Talk:Suicide

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Famous Suicides[change source]

As a psychologist, I feel a professional obligation to oppose this section of the article. Studies indicate that publicized suicides can increase the rate of suicides in a given area. While this may be far fetched in our case, Wikimedia has enough liability issues without the article. Therefore, I am going to remove this section of the article. If anyone has any objections, please discuss it here. -- Psy guy 21:11, 5 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I thought the Warring States Period was a time a chaos in China, not Japan. Isis 15:22, 29 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Abrahamic religions[change source]

I don't think that it's necessarily accurate to make a blanket statement that all believers of Abrahamic religions believe that those who commit suicide go to hell. For one, many Jews (and some Christians) do not believe in hell. Also, even those Christians who do are not necessarily uniform in their belief that suicide automatically leads to hell. I remember reading a syndicated Billy Graham column in the newspaper a few years back where he indicated that he did not hold to that belief. Perhaps we could change the wording to say that "many people who follow... believe that"? Kansan (talk) 15:17, 7 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Substance abuse[change source]

Currently there is a table in the "substance abuse" section, which links the abused substance to suicide-related effects/an explanation. I am not qualified, but rather than linking Alcohol to the chemical alcohols, wouldn't it be better to link it to Alcohol abuse? - I think the case is similar for the other substances; people reading this are not so much interested in the chemistry of alcohols, but rather in the case of it being abused. I know that for the other substances we probably do not have separate pages, one for the chemistry, and the other for its misuse. Since I do not know how to proceed, I leave this note here. --Eptalon (talk) 13:08, 10 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Level of difficulty[change source]

A discussion about the length and difficulty of this article is taking place at WP:Simple_talk#Very long & complex pages. Macdonald-ross (talk) 06:35, 14 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Tinkering round the edges won't help this page, so I suggest something more radical:

  1. Cut it back to the intro
  2. Add simply-written sections to answer questions which any person might reasonably ask, such as:
    1. Data on the frequency and distribution of suicides
    2. Predisposing causes, so far as known
    3. Socially sanctioned suicides
    4. Possibility of treatment, so far as known

This would cover much of the ground in the article, but in a more straightforward way. Editors should note that there is a separate page on suicide prevention, which means we do not have to go into so much detail here. Macdonald-ross (talk) 05:40, 15 April 2014 (UTC) Macdonald-ross (talk) 05:40, 15 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

We also have an article on Substance abuse. What do you think? Use the info in this table there but in prose and simplified? And link to there and simplify the remainder here? I have weeded out the images from 'prevention'. I plan to return to simplify and trim content in that section if no one beats me to it! Fylbecatulous talk 17:08, 18 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Good idea: you could take over the whole table plus a copy of its intro para, leaving just its intro para on this page. I'm going to greatly reduce the second half of this page in any event. Macdonald-ross (talk) 18:31, 18 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Done. Exactly so, but I simplified the remaining paragraph here on 'substance abuse'. See what you think. I have also trimmed and preened 'prevention' to the bone. Most of the material was already duplicated in the Suicide prevention article. That article has a better flow in readability to it anyway. I also took out two other image files in this article that were not important to the context. Fylbecatulous talk 04:29, 19 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Overall, the article looks much better as a result of your work. I've simplified the intro and enlarged a key diagram. This is experimental, to show what it looks like. If you use it "right" rather than "center" then I think it could be set at 250px. Macdonald-ross (talk) 06:37, 21 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. I tinkered with 250 and 300 but split the difference for 275px. It is still not overwhelming and still near the size of the other images for format. But visible even if one doesn't click through...please adjust to 250px if you think that is better. Fylbecatulous talk 23:48, 21 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Adding a Few Sentences under the Prevention Section[change source]

Hello,

I would like to add "Help is given to high at-risk people contemplating suicide by programs such as suicide hotlines and crisis prevention centers. They aim to provide all the help they can to those contemplating suicide until the thought of it subsides or goes away. Their target audience are students all around" (in addition to the citation), Under the Prevention Section of the page.

I would like to briefly add a a few sentences under the prevention section on the page. I read something in a textbook that would be a nice compliment to the information that’s already on the page.The sentences will entail how their are programs available to help people thinking about suicide in schools specifically for students in college. People who read the page may be college students looking for help. Adding these few sentences will definitely provide the guidance on how to get help that they may need.Ashleyv12 (talk) 07:08, 17 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Anyone can edit this page, and in general, your idea looks good. Keep the language simple, so that it is easy to understand. --Eptalon (talk) 08:51, 17 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]
@Eptalon: How does this sound? Is this better as a simpler version? "Help is offered to high at-risk people contemplating suicide by programs such as suicide hotlines and crisis prevention centers. They aim to provide help to college students until their suicidal thoughts subside or leave."Ashleyv12 (talk) 05:59, 19 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]
What about "Specialized suicide hotlines and crisis intervention centers offer help to people who feel they are at risk. There are programs for helping people with thoughts about suicide"? - I am not an expert, but in general, the active voice is easier to understand than the passive one. --Eptalon (talk) 14:01, 19 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Tweaking this a bit more: "Suicide hotlines and crisis intervention centers offer help to people who feel they are at risk. There are programs which help people if they think about suicide". You see we don't even have a page on hotline, and it's not in wiktionary. And does the second sentence here actually say anything? Macdonald-ross (talk) 14:08, 19 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you for the suggestions. Yes, active voice is always better than passive. Thank you for catching that. I still want to add a point on how these programs are offered to college students. Tweaking and finalizing: "Suicide hotline's and crisis intervention centers offer help to students who are at a high risk. They aim to provide help to people, particularly college students with suicidal thoughts." I think hotlines should still be included because it is still an additional resource for students contemplating suicide that come to this website.Ashleyv12 (talk) 17:42, 19 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"Die by"[change source]

I think this phrase is simpler and more neutral than "commit", and so improves the page for this wiki. Thank you! Macdonald-ross (talk) 09:30, 28 November 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Important points left out?[change source]

I just wonder if the following should be added (not necessarily in that phrasing):

  • Almost all the conditions ("mental illnesses") that lead people to think about/try to commit suicide can be managed/treated (to a point where peoole no longer think about suicide).
  • Some people survive suicide attempts (Where I live: the chance of surviving throwing yourself in front of a train is about one in three to one in five, IIRC. Don't ask what condition these people are in, and how they spend the rest of their lives
  • Being caught at a suicide attempt will mean you are placed in a mentail institution/sanatorium, in many parts of the world.
  • Suicide is one of the Diseases of despair Eptalon (talk) 21:54, 16 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Eptalon So for this statement Being caught at a suicide attempt will mean you are placed in a mentail institution/sanatorium, in many parts of the world. That is not always the case in the US. From my experience from working as a security office in hospitals, 5150's as they are called, are patients who have mental disabilities or conditions and with the 5150 we have to watch them around the clock by keeping eyes on them, making sure nothing goes in the room that is prohibited and 90% of the time (based on my work there) they were released back into the public after they have spoken with someone within the psychological field who makes the recommendation to release, transfer to a facility (ie in the US can also be a group home that houses people with suicidal attempts for short term) or they can continue the hold for however many hours they want to. Of course the 5150 is not the name we would call them by, it is just the California law code Article 1, Section 5150 of the California Welfare and Institutions Code.
On point one, I agree
On point two, I do not know much about trains because all of our trains go super slow and can stop on a dime if needed (If you ever come to SD and see a freight train, just turn off your vehicle and read a book it is going to be a while)
On point 4 I agree PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 22:19, 16 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The problem with trains is not one of speed, but one of design. Where I live (Europe), trains (at least passenger trains) run at speeds where they cannot stop at sight. So even if the train driver pulls an emergency stop, braking will usually take several kilometers. Eptalon (talk) 22:36, 16 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Eptalon Oh and the new bullet trains in Japan that hit 320kms per hour. There would be nothing left of a person and it would not be a medical emergency as the train driver wouldn't even know they hit something. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 22:38, 16 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]