Talk:Gender identity

The italics were mostly to make it more readable for an English learner. However, the italics on very in the last section actually change the meaning. So that I reverted. GID as a diagnosis is hugely, massively, exhorbitantly, psychotically controversial for both Transpeople and providers. Since is it not a good idea to use such big words here, I used italics to emphasize. -NickGorton 06:01, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

Sexual Orientation is not very specific. It says: "who you love". One can love his or her dogs. One can love his or her own parents. One can love his or her close possessions and friendship. One can love playing music. Maybe "which gender you prefer to be" is more specific.Coffsneeze 13:09, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

That doesnt make sense, Coffsneeze. What about saying "who you want to have sex with" -- accurate and to the point 98.227.181.234 (talk) 06:59, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

Under "sex" is found the text "a deep (male) voice or a high (female) voice". This is incorrect and hostile stereotyping. It is an established scientific fact that perception of a human voice as belonging to a male or a female is determined primarily by the frequency distribution of formants in the sound and hardly at all the (average) pitch of the sound. See any of various research theses on this topic, for example:- http://katnap.no-ip.biz:8800/media/thesis.pdf

I agree and have removed this. Kansan (talk) 06:20, 3 May 2010 (UTC)

Neutral

Why is this article not neutral?

Frogger48 (talk) 21:45, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

I wondered that too. I don't like this line 'People who feel like they do not fit "normal" gender roles are called transgender.' That's an awfully broad definition of transgender. Shiningroad (talk) 20:27, 15 December 2013 (UTC)

I'd say whoever suggested it has had plenty of time to explain themselves; I'm removing the template and replacing it with the remaining "sources missing" complaint. Feel free to add it back as long as you explain yourself. Filipkovarik (talk) 14:27, 9 February 2017 (UTC)

Gender presentation vs Gender role

As the article correctly says, gender presentation means how a person dresses, looks, and acts. Each person decides their own gender presentation—they dress and act the way they want to. However, the article also says that gender presentation and gender role are the same thing, but they are not at all the same thing. This is a mistake: the article is wrong and needs to be fixed so that it is clear that gender role is not the same thing as gender presentation. So, what is gender role, then?

Gender role is very different from gender presentation, because gender role does not come from inside a person. Gender role comes from outside—from other people. People in society have expectations about how they think men should dress, look, and act—that set of expectations about men is the male gender role in that society. Society also expects women to dress, look and act in a certain way, usually differently than men—this is society's female gender role. (The expectations for male or female clothing, appearance, and behavior may be different in other places, and at other times. So gender role isn't the same everywhere all the time—it belongs to a particular society at a particular time and place. For example, in Scotland, the male gender role includes the expectation that men may sometimes wear an article of clothing called a Kilt which looks like a skirt, but in America the male gender role does not allow men to wear kilts. Men in Rome 2,000 years ago could wear togas like many other men did at that time, but men in Rome today cannot wear togas: it is no longer part of the male gender role in modern-day Rome.) The article should be changed to give a proper definition for gender role as a societal expectation or set of ground rules for proper appearance and behavior for one sex or the other, in a given time and place.

The term gender expression is not in the article. Gender expression means the same thing as gender presentation. The term gender expression is used a lot more often than gender presentation: in fact, gender expression is used about 8 times more. These two terms should be included in the article as synonyms. The more important of the two terms is gender expression, and the other term gender presentation is a synonym that is used much less. The article should be changed to say this. Mathglot (talk) 04:38, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

Updates to article

Starting in on some changes to try to remove or fix some of the inaccuracies, and to introduce some missing content. As an example of the latter, not a thing was said about what the most common gender identities are, namely, man, woman, boy, and girl. It's axiomatic that this needs to be mentioned before launching into a discussion of what transgender means, so I've added a section about #Common identities.

Much of the rest of the article suffers from confusion about terms and other inaccuracies, and I hope to get to those later. There also needs to be a lot more sourcing, much of which can probably be pulled from the Wikipedia article. (P.s.: I realized that the talk page doesn't have to be in Simple English after I wrote the above, so apologies for that.)

@Flyer22 Reborn: Would love your help on the article, or at least feedback, if you get a chance; or recommendations who else to ping here. Mathglot (talk) 08:56, 29 September 2016 (UTC)

Mathglot, I just got your ping after months away from this site. From what I can see, you've done a good job. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 08:39, 5 October 2016 (UTC)