Wikipedia:Simple talk/Archive 136

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Sea of Japan

There seems to be a dispute/vandalism in regards to the name of the sea (see edit history), can someone please keep an eye on it? Tsugaru Let's Talk! :) 🍁 00:15, 12 May 2021 (UTC)

I think this is a general discussion about the name: South Korea wants the name East Sea, North Korea wants the name East Sea of Korea, no idea what China's name for it is; Japan obviously wants the name Sea of Japan. See en:Sea of Japan naming dispute. The short term solution for us is to mention both names; the tricky part is where to keep the article...--Eptalon (talk) 09:04, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
Just as an update: I have started the article Sea of Japan name problem, which is also linked from Sea of Japan.--Eptalon (talk) 11:32, 16 May 2021 (UTC)

Too many American rappers?

Hello, our category Category:American rap musicians currently has over 200 entries. I have given some idea on the category tlak page, but new ideas on how to subdivide them into managable categories; Note: In my opinion, categories by gender/sexual orientation, or categories by ethniciry are no solution. Interested people, please look at the category talk page, and perhaps leave a comment there...--Eptalon (talk) 09:09, 15 May 2021 (UTC)

We could organise them by state like they have done on enwiki, I think that would be the best thing to do. --Ferien (talk) 09:20, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
After going through the 200-odd entries, we now have entries for 21 of these states. In the case of Alabama, Tennessee, and Washington state, we do have 2 entries each; which is one to few for the categories to be kept. Does anyone know rappers form these states? - Also New York and California have over 40 entries; there we could look at subdividing further..--Eptalon (talk) 15:37, 15 May 2021 (UTC)
All done, the articles in the categories with too few entries have been moved to the top level category. We currently have subscategories for 18 states (where there are at least three entries). Feel free to create a new subcategory for a state once there are the required three entries (this is the normal policy, and nothing special). --Eptalon (talk) 11:11, 16 May 2021 (UTC)

Merge Category:Extinct plants and Category:Fossil plants

Please merge Category:Extinct plants and Category:Fossil plants. I think they mean pretty much the same thing. Pretty much all the extinct plants that scientists know about come from fossils. 2601:640:4000:3170:5035:DB55:1C77:A9B0 (talk) 04:51, 13 May 2021 (UTC)

They are not the same. I know of at least one extinct plant (can't remember the name of it) that was made extinct due to people harvesting it all. And it's possible that some plants that still exist are also found as fossils. So they aren't the same and neither should be a subcat of the other. --Auntof6 (talk) 06:29, 13 May 2021 (UTC)
Also see en:List of recently extinct plants, which includes some extinct plants that aren't known from fossils. --Auntof6 (talk) 06:32, 13 May 2021 (UTC)
You might mean silphium. Darkfrog24 (talk) 23:45, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
@Darkfrog24: Yes, that's the one; interesting history, isn't it? I looked it up later, but didn't think it was important to go back and specify. --Auntof6 (talk) 01:06, 19 May 2021 (UTC)
It's so rarely I get to talk about ancient mystery plants. Darkfrog24 (talk) 02:21, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

Dragon Ball Characters

For some reason, this show and Pokemon have seen a major surge in individual short stubs about all of the characters. Would there be an issue if we just did a list of all characters and link them? Also, if a character page was already created (ie. GoKu) and someone else creates Goku, the system allows it. Is there a way this can be salted or something so once the page is created, it cannot have a duplicate page? Thanks. PotsdamLamb (talk) 16:14, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

The way I know of is to proactively create redirects at likely alternate titles.
We could also make just one article "Dragonball characters" and have redirects straight to the appropriate section, the way House Elf redirects to the "creatures" section of Harry Potter. (The house elf of HP is based on pre-HP folklore, but it would be under Brownie, not "house elf.") Darkfrog24 (talk) 23:43, 18 May 2021 (UTC)
I like that idea. It will consume a lot of time too at the rate editors are adding pages! PotsdamLamb (talk) 07:03, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

2021 Board of Trustees Election

Hi there, Simple Wikipedia. I am an Election Volunteer for the Board of Trustees election. I want to tell you the 2021 Board of Trustees election is coming soon and as an Election Volunteer, my role is to ensure the Simple Wikipedia community is fully aware of the Board of Trustees election. The Wikimedia Foundation Board of Trustees oversees the Wikimedia Foundation's operations. Community trustees and appointed trustees make up the Board of Trustees. Each trustee serves a three year term. The Wikimedia community has the opportunity to vote for community trustees. See the complete timeline for the Board of Trustees [1]. Wikimedia contributors will vote to fill four seats on the Board in 2021. This is an opportunity to improve the representation, diversity, and expertise of the Board as a team. Community candidates are needed to run in this [2]. If you are not interested in running as a candidate, you may still participate by voting in this [3]. Let’s increase the number of voters participating in this election from our community. Please reach out with questions. -PotsdamLamb (talk) 07:03, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

My talkpage

Just changed the colours on it, can someone take a look at and let me know if the colour is too bright? Thanks Tsugaru Let's Talk! :) 🍁 02:33, 20 May 2021 (UTC)


Just a note for those of us who use IRC and don't follow along with the goings on at other projects, there is a discussion ongoing about moving Wikipedia off of the Freenode IRC network after what appears to have been a takeover. You can follow the discussion here. Just a heads up so we can all stay informed. --Gordonrox24 | Talk 14:49, 20 May 2021 (UTC)

Huh, IRC is leaving? Well then I am now sad, but what's best for the community is the best choice forward. I love using IRC lol --Tsugaru Let's Talk! :) 🍁 23:52, 20 May 2021 (UTC)
It's not leaving, it's just moving. You can, most likely, use whatever IRC client you were already using, but instead of connecting to freenode, you'll connect to You can read the guide on how to do that here.--Gordonrox24 | Talk 00:23, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
Ohhh --Tsugaru Let's Talk! :) 🍁 00:30, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
What the hell happened over at freenode?!--Derpdart56 (talk) 15:37, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
@Derpdart56: There was some sort of takeover and lots of Freenode staff have left and formed (talk) 17:56, 22 May 2021 (UTC)
All my Libera links have gone red and "/connect" doesn't do much. Is that a cross-Libera thing or something on my end? Darkfrog24 (talk) 22:44, 22 May 2021 (UTC)

Why do people scam phone numbers through Wikipedia and how

I want to know why they do it because it appears in an abuse filter. --2601:1C2:200:B610:1416:86A8:BBCA:6774 (talk) 23:49, 21 May 2021 (UTC)

I don’t know. I haven’t even known anybody who would even do that. C4Bomb2024 Talk 23:53, 21 May 2021 (UTC)

Look at this 2601:1C2:200:B610:1416:86A8:BBCA:6774 (talk) 00:01, 22 May 2021 (UTC)
Hmm, I don’t see any phone number in the abuse filter. C4Bomb2024 Talk 00:06, 22 May 2021 (UTC)
Why did you link to enwiki because you should not normally link there. C4Bomb2024 Talk 00:26, 22 May 2021 (UTC)
It’s only in article space where you shouldn’t link to enwiki. It is to do with the conversation so linking is acceptable. --Ferien2 (talk) 18:00, 22 May 2021 (UTC)


Can someone check out Thornhill Secondary School? The article is messy, but I'm not sure if it qualifies for quick deletion and which criteria it falls under. Etoza (talk) 12:16, 22 May 2021 (UTC)

In most cases, secondary schools do not qualify as notable (In general: we want institutes of higher education, so tertiary/university level is generally Ok, so are technical university or university-level business schools).--Eptalon (talk) 17:01, 22 May 2021 (UTC)
A little broader than that. Most countries have some schools which are elite in terms of reputation history and exam results. These are notable providing the evidence is visible or available. The article has to make the case. On the other hand universities are notable even if some might think them rubbish, providing they really are universities. Other types of post-school educational institutions such as the City College of San Francisco can make their case on merit. In those cases, as usual, the evidence must be sourced. Macdonald-ross (talk) 06:12, 27 May 2021 (UTC)
Actually in most cases secondary schools do qualify as notable per en:WP:OUTCOMES#Schools, however, like anything else they do need to meet WP:GNG. Grade schools/elementary schools do not, but secondary/highschools typically do. -Djsasso (talk) 18:38, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

Lots of badly written articles.

I noticed that (probably) one user has been making badly written articles about Nokia phones for a while. There are lots of them so I'd like to point them out: Nokia 6260 slide, Nokia 5510, Nokia N93i, Nokia 6700 classic, Nokia 3310 (2017), Nokia 3310, Nokia N93, Nokia 7650, Nokia 8800, Nokia 3510, Nokia N95, Nokia 5800 XpressMusic, Nokia 7250i. I'm not sure if this is all of them, but I'll update if I find more Etoza (?) 10:34, 24 May 2021 (UTC)

I made some changes to the Nokia 6260 slide article. Darubrub (Let me know) 16:07, 25 May 2021 (UTC)

Cleaning Up

Hello team. Over the next couple of days I will be going through some of the back logs of CS1 errors and getting them fixed. I was able to complete a little script at home and tested it on a few articles in the category. It worked as expected. Since I have to do this manually using copy/paste on average it’s about 3 min per page, but then if other errors are present, I’ll fix those. These include things like dead links with no archive links or dates. PotsdamLamb (talk) 08:54, 27 May 2021 (UTC)

What is the fix for that last one? Just remember that sometimes it's better to leave an error situation as it is rather than do a "cleanup" that just removes all trace of it. --Auntof6 (talk) 20:43, 27 May 2021 (UTC)
@Auntof6:For archives and dead links? I am manually finding archive links and putting them in based on the access-date the editor used and if no date is used, I use the date I worked on it. PotsdamLamb (talk) 20:46, 27 May 2021 (UTC)
And yes it is over 52k pages in the category, so I have to do this manually since I do not have permission for AWB. PotsdamLamb (talk) 20:48, 27 May 2021 (UTC)
That's not a task that would be approved for AWB anyway, because it isn't a simple dote task. --Auntof6 (talk) 20:58, 27 May 2021 (UTC)
This is now a moot point since Djsasso has a script that does what I was going to do which would have been an AWB task. I will withdraw my request for access. PotsdamLamb (talk) 21:23, 28 May 2021 (UTC)
I typically have a task that runs to clean these up but since I have been offline for a bit I haven't been running it. They will probably be cleared sometime today. -Djsasso (talk) 12:15, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

Using good articles more

Since we have so few VG articles, they get recycled too frequently. If we used GAs as well, there would be more variety for our main page. Whilst using the same ground rules, we have become tough-minded over promotions to VG (probably good), but it has the consequence that our main page is repetitious where it should be interesting. If we looked more interesting, we might get more good editors... Macdonald-ross (talk) 09:57, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

The thing is, the rules for a VG as compared to a G are specifically so they would not be embarrassing to have on the front page. Would defeat the purpose of having the VG class. -Djsasso (talk) 12:13, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

Reference Validation

Admins - Would anyone consider this booka valid reference (and the only reference) on an article, specifically Dressmaker? PotsdamLamb (talk) 21:27, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

Point of order: if you want to ask the admins something, the admins' noticeboard is the best place to do it. However, this doesn't seem like something that requires an admin to answer. --Auntof6 (talk) 21:47, 28 May 2021 (UTC)
Yeah I started typing something else out, thanks for pointing that out. I am striking out the admins part, as anyone can comment. PotsdamLamb (talk) 21:49, 28 May 2021 (UTC)
A published book is generally a valid source. There probably are better sources that can be used, but books that are not self published are generally reliable. -Djsasso (talk) 22:45, 28 May 2021 (UTC)
Yeah I was worried because the title states "The big book of beastly mispronunciations : the complete opinionated guide for the careful speaker" and the summary says "Contains an alphabetically arranged list of over one thousand commonly mispronounced words, including the author's explanation of how each word should be pronounced and a brief essay supporting his position. So putting those two together, would make me think it is an opinion piece and not necessarily a reliable source. Just my rationale on this book. PotsdamLamb (talk) 22:58, 28 May 2021 (UTC)
Yeah, it often comes down to what it is referencing. Sometimes a source can be a good reference for one thing and a bad reference for something else. As an example an auto-biography written by a musician might be a good source for their birth date for example, but it might not be a good source for some "fight" they got in or something and the details of it. But even that comes with a grain of salt as some people try to fudge their ages in the entertainment industry. There is a subject on this wiki for example who appears to have been paying people to edit their wiki page and they keep changing the birthdate to something that can't possibly be his age because he is in interviews giving the story of when he immigrated to the country he lives in now and how old he was when he immigrated which was before his supposed birth date, and unfortunately articles are starting to use the fake date because he put the fake date on his IMDB which reporters take their info from a lot (which is why imdb can't be used as a source as its completely unreliable). So it is hard to give exact answers sometimes. But I would be inclined to accept the book or better yet see if I can't find a better source. -Djsasso (talk) 00:58, 29 May 2021 (UTC)
Understood PotsdamLamb (talk) 04:44, 29 May 2021 (UTC)


I am not sure where to post a request for a template to be moved over. I noticed we do not have en:Template:Infobox restaurant. I have found a few articles that call this template but since I cannot find it on simple, I wanted to see if it can be copied and set-up. I am not familiar with that process yet. Thanks. PotsdamLamb (talk) 23:29, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

There are two options for templates. You can either copy/paste them over and attribute them as you would an article. This is probably best used on things like navboxes that are simple and often don't rely on other templates. For more complex templates if you don't feel confident in copying it over yourself you can ask an admin to import it for you either on a talk page or the administrators noticeboard. I have imported this infobox for you. -Djsasso (talk) 00:30, 29 May 2021 (UTC)
@Djsasso: so it would just be creating a new page titled Template:…… then copy it over and click on the data button to import the suggestions and save then the pages should populate with the template? PotsdamLamb (talk) 00:35, 29 May 2021 (UTC)
You would go to click edit and copy the source code for the template and the come back and start a new page called Template:Whatever and click edit so that the edit window opens and you would paste the source code into the box and hit Publish Changes just like you would with any regular edit. You would need to do this in the source editor not the visual editor. And then you would add attribution just the same way you would if you copied an article over from -Djsasso (talk) 00:38, 29 May 2021 (UTC)
Gotcha! Thanks I’ll do it later as I’m mobile now and don’t want to do it via my phone so not to screw it up! PotsdamLamb (talk) 00:41, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Movie title in page name

I want to create a page for the movie Lies My Father Told Me (based on simplified content from EN WP). How to italicize the page name, which appears to be the style for similar pages? Help, thanks! -- Deborahjay (talk) 12:54, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

I don't know, but what you provide as an example looks pretty standard. I mean, oF mIce aNd mEn is a well-known work (by Steinbeck, I think). It is based on a book he wrote in 1937. Classic what you read at school (as long as people still read books at school). There are two movies, and oddly enough, one of them is en:Of Mice and Men (1992 film).--Eptalon (talk) 13:48, 29 May 2021 (UTC)
Thanks, but the syntax is what I don't get. When I searched the title here - expecting not to find it so it would appear in red with the option to "Create..." - it of course appeared non-italicized. When I searched with a pair of apostrophes leading and following, hoping that would create a page name in italics, the apostrophes showed up in the red suggested page title. What to do? -- Deborahjay (talk) 13:52, 29 May 2021 (UTC)
Look at Template:Italic title, it probably does what you want...--Eptalon (talk) 13:56, 29 May 2021 (UTC)
That template does look like the way to achieve this result. I especially like the example you have (en:Of Mice and Men (1992 film)) that combines an italicized title and a parenthetical distinction. Will get to it soon as I can actually create the page with adequate content. Cheers! -- Deborahjay (talk) 14:04, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Disambugation Pages

In patrolling I came across National routes (South Africa) which is in the category Category:Articles with links needing disambiguation. There is a somewhat identical article as well titled Numbered routes in South Africa. Under what links here is Special:WhatLinksHere/National routes (South Africa). I do not know how to do this type of work. If someone would want to show me, I would appreciate it. I did read Wikipedia:Disambiguation but it is not very helpful. Heck, someone may have a script in their arsonal that fixes this as there are only 21 pages in the cat. Thanks! PotsdamLamb (talk) 20:19, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

This has been answered at Auntof6s'talk page. Thanks! PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 07:50, 1 June 2021 (UTC)

'Deaths in' pages

I wanted to start a dialog, especially involving @TDKR Chicago 101 about some changes for this page. I feel it can better be simplified by doing the following:

1. For the headers, if we just put in ==May== or ==June== will then display on the page TOC as ==1 May== or ==5 June== depending on the hierarchy.
2. The pages should always be named 'Deaths in (month) 2021 from the beginning, instead of just 'Deaths in 2021' to avoid confusion.
3. Not use redirects; I was going to start the June 2021 page and it showed it had a page already, but it was a redirect to the 'Deaths in 2021 page' (which was the page I was on, which was for May, not June).
4. Maybe create a template for the layout so it is easier to populate and would have the instructions commented in the page source code.

What are peoples thoughts on this? Thanks! PotsdamLamb (talk) 18:39, 31 May 2021 (UTC)

The reason it is laid out that way is that we redirect the month to the Deaths in 2021 page until the month has ended. At which point the May deaths go to their own month page (which had been a redirect) Deaths in May 2021. It is done this way because we assume the reader coming to the page on a given month in 2021 is likely looking for the deaths that just happened recently. Once the year is done the Deaths in 2021 page is just a page of links to the various month pages. This makes the Deaths in page much more reader friendly and useable in the current month. It makes it simplier for the reader as they don't have to click through multiple pages to find the current months deaths and it makes it so the Deaths in 2021 page doesn't have too much information on it after a couple of months.
The reason for not just doing ==May== is that while through a quirk of how the page displays it might look nice to the reader, it makes it impossible to edit the page as you don't know what section is what when you edit it. (in fact I am correcting this on the may page you copied over as we speak because it became impossible to edit as I could no longer tell what sections were for what day) -Djsasso (talk) 23:02, 31 May 2021 (UTC)
Essentially at the end of every month the contents in Deaths in 2021 would be moved towards the Deaths in (the month they represent) 2021 redirect. The current layout is meant to make it easier for the reader and to prevent a long page full of entries from an entire year which in turn causes the page to lag because of the huge amount of sources. --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 02:58, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
@Djsasso@TDKR Chicago 101 - Ok got you. Thanks for the information. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 07:45, 1 June 2021 (UTC)

2021 Board of Trustees Election

Hi there, Simple Wikipedia. I am an Election Volunteer for the 2021 Board of Trustees election. I want to tell you the 2021 Board of Trustees election is coming soon and as an Election Volunteer, my role is to ensure the Simple Wikipedia community is fully aware of the Board of Trustees' election. The Wikimedia Foundation Board of Trustees oversees the Wikimedia Foundation's operations. Community trustees and appointed trustees make up the Board of Trustees. Each trustee serves a three-year term. The Wikimedia community has the opportunity to vote for community trustees. See the complete timeline for the Board of Trustees. Wikimedia contributors will vote to fill four seats on the Board in 2021. This is an opportunity to improve the representation, diversity, and expertise of the Board as a team. Community candidates are needed to run in this election. If you are not interested in running as a candidate, you may still participate by voting in this voting information. Let’s increase the number of voters participating in this election from our community. Please reach out to me directly with any questions. If I do not know the answer, we have a messaging app we use so I can directly ask the question and get a response back almost immediately. Thanks and I hope you will help out (or even run as a candidate). PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 07:57, 1 June 2021 (UTC)

Notability - towns

I've seen several articles similar to Teontha and I don't see the specific notability of them. Is there some special criterion we're adding in? For example, I've heard that any species of animal is automatically notable. Is there a similar rule for towns? Darkfrog24 (talk) 15:44, 1 June 2021 (UTC)

@Darkfrog24 - Notability Exceptions states Legally recognized, populated places are presumed to be notable. Hope that helps you. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 16:38, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
@Darkfrog24 - BTW I just tagged that article for QD Breaking copyright with a 96.6% violation. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 16:42, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
Excellent, PDL. That is exactly the sort of information I needed. I come across plenty of town and village articles. Darkfrog24 (talk) 19:07, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
@Darkfrog24 I usually just leave those alone unless it is in an error category. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 19:13, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
Oh, my daily routine on here is to go to the uncategorized articles page and pick something to spruce up, usually by adding sources and categories. But if an article isn't notable, I don't want to bother. Darkfrog24 (talk) 19:15, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
@Darkfrog24 The problem you will have with that on towns, is almost all of them are very short stub (i.e. french communes) where it is literally one sentence and a copy of the infobox with cats already. If you really want to research them, have at it. I did come across one this morning in Switzerland that is no longer a municipality as of 1 January 2021. I was going to update data from 2012 and couldn't find the recent information. Looked at EN and they said 'was a commune' so I looked it up and sure as well, no longer. lol PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 19:21, 1 June 2021 (UTC)


I am trying to find a way that I can filter Category:Requests for deletion that succeeded so I can do it by year (i.e. 2021, 2020, etc.). How can this be done, as it does not seem to be broken down beyond that and the cat itself is every year. Thanks! PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 19:01, 1 June 2021 (UTC)

@PotsdamLamb: If you want, I can load them up in AWB and sort them, then make a list on a subpage page in your userspace. The list would be in order by year. By the way, when you say "do it by year," what would you be doing? --Auntof6 (talk) 20:42, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
So I’m looking to just have them sorted by 2020 and 2021. I’m looking to see if they have been recreated to meet any guidelines or if it’s still should be deleted. If they are then get them categorized and add info. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 20:44, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
OK. So do you want me to make you a list or not? --Auntof6 (talk) 20:48, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
@Auntof6 Oh sorry. Yes please if you would.@Auntof6 PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 20:48, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
User:PotsdamLamb/Successful RFDs sorted by year --Auntof6 (talk) 21:16, 1 June 2021 (UTC)
@Auntof6 Thanks! PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 21:24, 1 June 2021 (UTC)


I was trying to update the English football updater, but I ended up having to revert all my work because something went wrong. Can someone help me figure out what I did wrong, and if I can restore and fix my edit? Thanks, AnApple47 (talk) 05:54, 2 June 2021 (UTC)

@AnApple47 What were you trying to update? PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 05:55, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
The league positions of the teams. AnApple47 (talk) 05:57, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
@AnApple47 Ok I reverted that specific page to prior to your edits (the one you listed above). It looks like there is a different page that you have to go to in order to update them. Let me follow the cookies and I’ll post shortly unless someone beats me to it. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 06:02, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
@AnApple47 So looking at the coding, it all looks correct. I’m thinking it may be a character limit in the lua.module because it cuts off at a weird place in the coding. If you try just one section at a time, would/does that work? PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 06:29, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
@AnApple47 test out that template on 2020–21 EFL Championship and see if it will populate correctly. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 06:37, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
@PotsdamLamb um, I don't think that's what the template's used for. I think its used just for updating each individual's clubs position. For example, Chelsea. On a side note, I could create 2020–21 EFL Championship if you wanted. Either way, thank you for all your help! AnApple47 (talk) 06:45, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
@AnApple47 Yeah I saw the changes. { and } will get you every time. Do you want that page? I created it already but it is blank minus a line that says we are working on it or do you have the 20-21 play off pages already?@AnApple47 PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 06:48, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
@PotsdamLamb Yep, {} are brutal indeed. Since I don't know of any play-off pages, I'll try and create the page to the best of my ability. AnApple47 (talk) 06:51, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
@AnApple47 This is gonna be a good way for us to learn about setting up game brackets and such. I haven’t done those yet but there is documentation on it. If you want to … and as I was typing this you started so I’ll carry over to the talk page there. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 06:53, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
@PotsdamLamb Sure, I'll see you there. AnApple47 (talk) 06:56, 2 June 2021 (UTC)

Template Error

So I can not figure out the category of Category:Pages using infobox settlement with bad settlement type. Obviously it is pretty well self describing, however, when I look at say the Template:Infobox Swiss town it has all of the correct parameters from what I can see when I compare it against the EN versions. Can someone help me figure out why there are 2900 pages that show this error please? Thanks! PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 05:00, 2 June 2021 (UTC)

Yeah has the same error. Its been an issue for awhile. It is likely we both have errors in our templates somewhere. Been looking into it for a few months. -Djsasso (talk) 15:25, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
@Djsasso If I am correct, it looks like it is a rough copy of infobox settlement? If it is, why can we not just use that infobox? PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 15:39, 2 June 2021 (UTC)
Its called a template wrapper. It is using Infobox Settlement, but it adds stuff on top of infobox settlement. The error likely isn't coming from the Swiss town template. -Djsasso (talk) 16:04, 2 June 2021 (UTC)

Link a language pronunciation

I came across an article and this was linked داریوش شایگان however, it would show up as 2 داریوش شایگان February 1955........ How do I correct it so it shows correctly? Thanks. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 16:52, 3 June 2021 (UTC)

What is the page? -Djsasso (talk) 16:53, 3 June 2021 (UTC)
@Djsasso It is Dariush Shayegan. Please don't do it for me. Please explain to me or point to where I can find out how to do it so I can learn. Thanks! PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 16:54, 3 June 2021 (UTC)
It's just using the wrong brackets for the template. Should be {{ instead of [[ etc. -Djsasso (talk) 16:56, 3 June 2021 (UTC)
work for me. I will do that. Thanks! PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 16:57, 3 June 2021 (UTC)
@Djsasso so when I put in ({{lang=fa|داریوش شایگان}} 2 February 1935 – 22 March 2018) it comes up in preview as (Template:Lang=fa 2 February 1935 – 22 March 2018) . Did I miss something? PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 17:01, 3 June 2021 (UTC)
It should be lang-fa not lang=fa. -Djsasso (talk) 17:13, 3 June 2021 (UTC)
@Djsasso That worked! Thank you! PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 17:14, 3 June 2021 (UTC)

Bot-creating Wikidata items for new articles and categories here

Hi all. For enwiki, dewiki, and ptwiki I bot-create new Wikidata items for articles and categories after 14 days, see d:Wikidata:Requests for permissions/Bot/Pi bot 19 for the full info. I would like to do the same here. It wouldn't involve any edits here, just on Wikidata, but I think Pi bot would need 'confirmed' status here to avoid getting captchas. Would this be of interest / any concerns or questions? Please ping me when you reply, as I don't normally watch this wiki. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 19:43, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

@Mike Peel I kind of like that idea. Can you show us some pages and the wikidata information it created please? I think that will give us a much better picture. Thanks, PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 20:04, 4 June 2021 (UTC)
@PotsdamLamb: For most articles, it would create quite empty items like Broomielaw railway station (Q107104175). For biographies, it adds more, see e.g., Alexis Laura Daniels (Q107104185). The aim is to get things started on Wikidata, not to add lots of info yet. I have some students working on a new version of the code that will add more info (and go back through articles that already have items to retrieve info from them), but that's for the future. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 20:16, 4 June 2021 (UTC)
@Mike Peel Well I like the idea. I would be interested in what others think as they come to the board. Thanks for responding so quickly. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 20:19, 4 June 2021 (UTC)
@Mike Peel I wanted to ask does it also fix errors between an article and the data? i.e. On a page, we may have coordinates for it, but they may be off from what data has, so it throws an error stating there are coordinates on wikidata, but yet a manual check shows there is. Which would win in this fight, your bot or the page? PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 21:27, 4 June 2021 (UTC)
@PotsdamLamb: This script doesn't handle coordinates, so there's no fight. :-) If you want, I could also import coordinates though, that's Wikidata:Requests for permissions/Bot/Pi bot 18 - this would only import coordinates to Wikidata where there aren't any on Wikidata, so wouldn't cause new errors. I'm also semi-automatedly matching articles with existing Wikidata items at the moment, in those cases I'm not copying coordinates but they could cause errors. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 07:28, 5 June 2021 (UTC)
@Mike Peel Gotcha. I was thinking about that because I was working on a few articles of areas with no coordinates or the coordinates didn’t match wikidata so I’ve been going in and completing/creating them. Thanks, PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 07:30, 5 June 2021 (UTC)
I support this idea. @Mike Peel: the bot is already autoconfirmed. --Ferien (talk) 20:21, 4 June 2021 (UTC)
@Mike Peel: A couple of concerns:
  • You say create Wikidata items. Many (if not most) articles/pages created here don't need Wikidata items created; they need to be added to existing Wikidata items.
  • If the bot adds pages here to existing Wikidata items, how would it know what items to add them to? Pages here don't always have names that match the names anywhere else.
In case it could affect what the bot does, you might want to familiarize yourself with some of the things that are different on this Wikipedia. I have a list of some of them at User:Auntof6/simplediffs; you can let me know if you have any questions.
Thanks. --Auntof6 (talk) 07:47, 5 June 2021 (UTC)
@Auntof6 I just wanted to point out it would not create anything on this Wikipedia. All the writing will be done to Wikidata. It’s basically mining the information and getting the data updated. Ppsssttt I like that list. Very helpful. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 07:55, 5 June 2021 (UTC)
@PotsdamLamb: Yes, I know how the Wikidata items work. The description says that the bot would create Wikidata items; that would be on Wikidata. It's just that very many of the articles created here are based on enwiki articles, and Wikidata items have already been created for most of them. You don't create a separate Wikidata item every time there's a new article on a different Wikipedia. If you look at a Wikidata item, for example this one for Kamala Harris, at the bottom left you will see all the Wikipedia articles related to that item (or at least all of the ones that have been connected to this item). If another Wikipedia creates an article for this subject, it should be added to that item, not have a new item created. --Auntof6 (talk) 08:05, 5 June 2021 (UTC)
@Auntof6: The bot only creates new items, it doesn't match to existing items. There are categories and articles here that don't have counterparts on other wikis, which is what this bot is aimed at. It also only creates items after 14 days - it assumes that if the item was going to be linked to an existing item, then it would have been in 2 weeks after creation, and it effectively moves it into the workflow of people that merge items on Wikidata so it increases the chances that it will end up at the right item in the future. Finally, I also run a separate script that searches Wikidata for matches and prompts me to check if it is a match, I'm working through the backlog at the moment. If there's a place I could put potential matches that others would look through, please let me know - maybe a Wikidata Game if anyone would play it? Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 08:06, 5 June 2021 (UTC)
@Mike Peel: On this wiki, I don't think you can assume that articles will be connected to Wikidata after 14 days, maybe not after any specific length of time. We have a small workforce, so things don't get done as quickly as they might. Also, some of the editors probably don't think beyond this wiki. I know I've asked several times for people to keep up with Wikidata, but with mixed results.
I guess another questions would be, for any given article, how do you know it doesn't have a counterpart on another wiki?
I used to play some of the Wikidata games when Wikidata was new. That could work, as long as people know exactly what has to be done. --Auntof6 (talk) 08:19, 5 June 2021 (UTC)
@Auntof6: Some examples: searching for Aar Dheel returns no matches on Wikidata, searching for Adam Hollingsworth finds Adam Hollingsworth (Q4679247) but that's a different person. At the moment I'm running through matches myself, but it would be good if others could be encouraged to do so. A game would look similar to the Commons category matching game that I created. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 08:28, 5 June 2021 (UTC)
 Comment I try to link to wikidata. Auntof6 has been training me where to place it but I have created a few of the data sets. There was one today I couldn’t like to simple as it hit its max wiki limit. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 08:56, 5 June 2021 (UTC)
@PotsdamLamb: No, I've been showing you where to put Commons templates. That's nothing to do with Wikidata links. Also, can you explain what you're talking about in your last sentence? I don't see how it relates to either Commons or Wikidata. --Auntof6 (talk) 09:04, 5 June 2021 (UTC)
sorry it was a mix of two things.
In wikidata the article I was working on was coming up with errors about not matching the wikidata information. I found the corresponding wikidata but at the right where it is linked simple was not there nor would it let me add it. This particular data had a lot of information compared to others and then I click on simple and the page save go back to the page and refresh and the error is gone. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 09:08, 5 June 2021 (UTC)

4 articles demoted...

Hello all, Jessica Alba, Anna Kournikova, Daniela Hantuchová and Ana Ivanović used to be Very good articles, but after a discussion, the community agreed they were no longer. I have therefore demoted all of them to regular article. Currently, there are two more articles up for discussion, where there is less consensus. Interested editors: please take a look and leave a comment, if you like. --Eptalon (talk) 09:07, 6 June 2021 (UTC)

I just demoted these in Wikidata. --Auntof6 (talk) 09:39, 6 June 2021 (UTC)

Call for Candidates 2021 Board of Trustees election

Hello all,

The 2021 Board of Trustees election is coming soon. Candidates from the community are needed to fill the available seats.

The Wikimedia Foundation Board of Trustees oversees the Wikimedia Foundation's operations. Community trustees and appointed trustees make up the Board of Trustees. Each trustee serves a three year term. The Wikimedia community has the opportunity to vote for community trustees.

Wikimedia contributors will vote to fill four seats on the Board in 2021. This is an opportunity to improve the representation, diversity, and expertise of the Board as a team.

Who are potential candidates? Are you a potential candidate?


Wikimedia is a global movement and seeks candidates from the broader community. Candidates should think about what experiences and perspectives they will bring to the Board. Ideal candidates align with the Wikimedia mission and are thoughtful, respectful, and community-oriented. The Board would like to find perspectives and voices that are under-represented and essential for our movement. They should bring what Wikimedia needs from a new Trustee.


Trustees serve a three year term and can serve up to three consecutive terms. The time commitment is about 150 hours per year, excluding travel. This time is not evenly spread throughout the year. The time is concentrated around meetings. The expectation is that Trustees serve on at least one of the Board’s committees.


English is the language of business for the Board. Candidates need a basic understanding of English, but support and training are part of onboarding. Candidate applications will be translated into several languages to reach a broad audience of voters.


Candidates from all projects and communities who meet the needs of Wikimedia Trustee are welcome. If you know someone who could be a good trustee, encourage them to run for election. Candidates can find information and submit their nomination on the Apply to be a Candidate page.

Thank you for your support,

The Wikimedia Foundation Board of Trustees

Special Note: At the time of nomination or election, you may not be banned or blocked from any Wikimedia project for a period of 30 days or longer; If you only meet the voter eligibility requirements as an editor: Your first edit must have been before 9 June 2019. Reference bullet points 3 and 4 under topic title eligibility

If you have any questions, please feel free to ask me and I will be happy to answer them. Thanks! PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 15:48, 8 June 2021 (UTC)


I forgot how to do the Nihongo templates, I did the change here can someone fix it for me? Thanks Tsugaru Let's Talk! :) 🍁 23:49, 8 June 2021 (UTC)

@つがる Welcome back! I saw your post I hope all is well. Here is the template link with the parameters and how to use it. Template:Nihongo. Typically if you go to the search box and type in template: and the first couple of letters it will pull up everything for you. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 00:13, 9 June 2021 (UTC)
Thanks for the help! I will actually need to report back to the hospital tomorrow for an EEG, so I don't know how long they will keep me there for. --Tsugaru Let's Talk! :) 🍁 00:23, 9 June 2021 (UTC)
@つがる So it looks like you want Kabuki (Japanese: かぶき)? If so you just reversed your words ;) PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 00:23, 9 June 2021 (UTC)
Yea, I guess I did! I'll fix it shortly :) --Tsugaru Let's Talk! :) 🍁 00:31, 9 June 2021 (UTC)

Main Page/styles.css

Anyone know the purpose of this page? Nunabas (talk) 14:15, 8 June 2021 (UTC)

@Nunabas Anything ending in a .css is a cascading styling sheet. In simple terms, it sets the format for a given page. It is the preferred method of stylizing websites over HTML now. Hope that helps! PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 15:32, 8 June 2021 (UTC)
However that is in the main namespace, which means that the .css doesnt mean anything nor is it actually a subpage of the main page. Nunabas (talk) 17:35, 8 June 2021 (UTC)
Can an admin either delete that page or provide an explanation of what it does? Nunabas (talk) 02:01, 10 June 2021 (UTC)
@Nunabas I can tell you without being an admin that it cannot be deleted. It styles the main page of this Wikipedia and it is transcluded to many other pages. This page is not something to worry about. Why would you even request this to be deleted? PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 04:50, 10 June 2021 (UTC)
It styles the main page. -Djsasso (talk) 11:22, 10 June 2021 (UTC)

Can I create a deleted page from English main wikipedia?

Hello There, I am new here and I Have come across a subject who although is deleted on Main wikipedia because back then he wasn't having sufficient sources, But Now I feel that the subject do passes GNG and have sources enough, Can I create is over here or is there any AFC on this wiki where a reviewer can review my creation or help me in getting created few of the articles, as I want to contribute over here as well, as this site have articles but they need more active editors, Thanks Suryabeej (talk) 17:24, 8 June 2021 (UTC)

@Suryabeej Hi and welcome to Simple Wikipedia. It is dependent on the subject and if it meets our requirements. You can create the page here, but if you go to create it and you see it has already been deleted by an admin, then see the reason why and make sure to meet the requirements. Who is the subject? PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 17:27, 8 June 2021 (UTC)
User:PotsdamLamb Thanks for the quick response the subject is Vivek Verma and since the last deletion on the main english wikipedia now it has reliable sources which I thing passes the GNG you can check this draft out here [4] for an Idea Suryabeej (talk) 17:32, 8 June 2021 (UTC)
@Suryabeej We do not have an "AFC" like EN does. All articles are reviewed by a number of people from the admins to new page patrollers, to our very active editors. You will notice we do not have a lot of the same rules or features as EN does, as we are considered a small wiki. Once you create the article, you can always start a discussion on the talk page and put {{help}} on the articles talk page of the article and post here on simple talk the link and you are looking for help. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 17:32, 8 June 2021 (UTC)
User:PotsdamLamb Okay got that, can you have alook at the draft and its sources and tell me if I can create it over here or not ? Thanks Suryabeej (talk) 17:35, 8 June 2021 (UTC)
@Suryabeej I am going to let someone else answer that question for you. Give it some time for someone to look at it that is highly skilled at the this. It looks like you have some good sources, but as a musician he needs to meet the requirements for a musician. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 17:38, 8 June 2021 (UTC)
@PotsdamLamb I took a look at the requirements for a musician and I feel it does passes this criteria, but still someone more experienced having a look at this will make a more accurate decision, Thus I would request you to connect someone who can have a look at this, Thanks Suryabeej (talk) 17:43, 8 June 2021 (UTC)
@Suryabeej This page is watched by a lot of people, so I am sure it won't take long. I cannot ping or bring someone in. They will join if they feel so. I am a 50/50 on the notability which is why I want someone else to help with the criteria on this artist. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 17:50, 8 June 2021 (UTC)
@PotsdamLamb Sure Not a problem, I appreciate your guidance Thanks :) Suryabeej (talk) 17:55, 8 June 2021 (UTC)
@Suryabeej I think you should be good to go. Please make sure to follow all the rules of Wikipedia and use all the proper formatting. If you try to add to a red link category then that category hasn’t been created. We need at least 3 articles in it for us to create it. As a new page patroller, what I look for is:
properly categorized
Page is wikified
Page name bolded at beginning of intro
important terms linked, even if the links are red
page makes sense
Appropriate number of references. When there are references, a reference section should be included with a hardcoded {{reflist}} template
No links to enwiki articles
No use of any Wikipedia as a reference
Is there an image?
Is there an infobox?
A link to the Commons category, if one exists. even though the last three aren’t a requirement on a BLP I like to seen them because it gives me a great overview. Once it is going and you have it about 1/2 way done, let me know so I can check things and help you correct them before completing it. Since this is a BLP, references need to be published, fixed on a solid platform (not someone’s Twitter, YouTube channel, etc.) They all need to be facts. Lastly make sure to use simple English. If I haven’t already I’ll post a welcome message to your talk page with links for you to go through. PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 01:00, 9 June 2021 (UTC)
@PotsdamLamb Hi sorry for responding a bit late, I've created a draft as per the way you mentioned above please have a look at User:Suryabeej/Vivek Verma and if you feel like it is good to go then you also can move it to the mainspace or lemme know if I need to do that from my end, also there are many red links in the article which I will be creating next so that I can contribute well in regarding the Indian Entertainment section, apart from this, I also found This in Commons which has been uploaded by some some of the users out of which one is blocked so if its okay then only we can use one of these pictures, Rest do lemme know incase you feel like me to change anything into the draft, Thanks Suryabeej (talk) 14:28, 9 June 2021 (UTC)
Oops My Bad I can't move it as I don't have the option yet. Thanks Suryabeej (talk) 14:37, 9 June 2021 (UTC)
@Suryabeej I moved the page. You can find it at Vivek Verma. I have also started the discussion on the talk page location at Talk:Vivek Verma. Let's move the conversation over there and work on the article in parts. Thanks, PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 17:35, 9 June 2021 (UTC)

@PotsdamLamb Sure Thanks, I'll be commenting on the talk page for further discussion. Suryabeej   talk 19:00, 9 June 2021 (UTC)

System Default

Is there a way to change the MediaWiki system default on my end to British English? Tsugaru Let's Talk! :) 🍁 21:21, 9 June 2021 (UTC)

@つがる Yes! Go to your preferences (possibly called 'my settings'). On the first tab, scroll down and select the 'More language settings' link. Select 'Display' (should be the default selection). Under display language to the right, click on the box with the three . (i.e. ...). Scroll down to Europe. Select British English. It will then take you back to the first screen with British English selected (it will be blue in color). Then click on the "Apply settings" button (also turned blue at this point) and you should be good to go. :) PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 22:40, 9 June 2021 (UTC)
Thanks for the help - I have applied the changes. --Tsugaru Let's Talk! :) 🍁 02:55, 10 June 2021 (UTC)
@つがる Awesome possum! Glad I could help you! PDLTalk to me!OMG, What have I done? 04:51, 10 June 2021 (UTC)